[FM Discuss] Editions [was : ISBN Numbers Summary]

[Edward Cherlin]

On Sat, Mar 28, 2009 at 12:05 PM, adam hyde <adam at flossmanuals.net> wrote:
> hi,
>
> This has been a very interesting and educational discussion. I have one
> basic question - why do we need to update the isbn per 'edition'?
> Indeed, why even talk of editions?

Only if we intend to sell them through booksellers, including Amazon.
In that case, it is mandatory. This does not apply to print on demand,
and we should not use ISBNs on those versions except when the
identical work is sold through Amazon or some other reseller.

http://www.isbn-international.org/en/download/2005%20ISBN%20Users%27%20Manual%20International%20Edition.pdf

ISBN Users' Manual International edition (2005)

5.1 General
A separate ISBN shall be assigned to each separate monographic
publication or separate
edition of a monographic publication issued by a publisher. A separate
ISBN shall be
assigned to each different language edition of a monographic
publication. Where a
publication is made available to the public both individually and as
part of a series, it shall
be regarded as two separate publications, each of which shall be
assigned a separate
ISBN.

5.2 Changes to publications
A separate ISBN shall be assigned if there have been significant
changes to any part or
parts of a publication. A separate ISBN shall be assigned if there has
been a change to the
title of a publication. A change to the cover design or colour or to
the price of a
monographic publication does not require a separate ISBN. Minor
changes in an edition
(e.g., corrections to misprints) do not require a separate ISBN.

Print on demand is not publication in the sense used here, where many
entities want to be able to rely on ISBN=version.

> I find the idea of editions belongs to a mode of operating that doesn't
> suit at all how we actually work.

But we are trying to work with organizations that cannot change their
mode of operations to accommodate us. Not this year, anyway. When we
become a power in the industry, we can discuss such questions with the
rest of the industry.

> It would be very odd for us to get to
> a point of questioning if this is edition 1.2.3 or 7. For example. I
> have published 12 revisions of the command line book since it was
> released. What place does an edition have in this work flow?

None.

> I don't see it. I am very loathe for us to get stuck on this because it
> seems to be a term that belongs to how publishing works and not how we
> work. We are in a transitional moment, its true, and we are offering a
> way of creating sophisticated content which doesn't currently sit easily
> within existing publishing practice and occassionally we will have to
> bend a little to fit into the existing practices...but I don't see this
> as necessary within the context of this current discussion until vendors
> start pushing FM books and stamping their feet because we dont make
> sense to them. Then we might have to harmonise a little with their
> inventory management processes and call something 'edition x'.
>
> Until then I would very much enjoy being liberated from ideas of
> Editions when discussing FM. It doesnt seem to me to reflect how we
> actually work, and it suggests a workflow and paradigm that we don't,
> from choice, fit.
>
> adam
>
>
>
> On Sat, 2009-03-28 at 10:32 -0400, C. Scott Ananian wrote:
>> On Fri, Mar 27, 2009 at 8:50 PM, David Farning <dfarning at sugarlabs.org> wrote:
>> > A second level of confusions results because in addition of buying a
>> > block of ISBNs a publisher must register a book's the title in 'Books
>> > in Print' Database.  It is via accessing the Books in print database
>> > that other wholesaler and resellers can order and sell the book.
>> >
>> > In addition to the 'Books in Print' publishers can register with other
>> > services to raise their profile.  To extend the phone metaphor past
>> > its useful life.... Every phone number is listed in the white pages.
>> > The more you pay the bigger your add in the yellow pages.
>>
>> I'd be wary of paying for there "other services".  Really, Books in
>> Print is more like the white pages, not the yellow pages.  It's free
>> (more or less) and just provides a <isbn number> to <contact
>> information for distributor> mapping, so that if you want 500 copies
>> of a particular ISBN, you look up the right phone number and call up
>> the distributor to order them.  That's it, it's easy.
>>
>> The trick is that many large retailers don't like dealing with small
>> distributors.  So even though the "number's in the book" for the ISBN,
>> they won't pick up the phone and call, because their ordering systems
>> aren't integrated, or they've have bad experiences with billing, or
>> they've been scammed in the past, or it's just more trouble than it's
>> worth.
>>
>> People offer lots of suggestions for how to "make it worth their
>> while" (these "other services") but in my experience and opinion,
>> they're mostly scams -- and often counter productive scams, which will
>> cause businesses to avoid lulu-printed books even more when the hook
>> is discovered.  It's not that hard to get your book listed, and Amazon
>> *will* stock your book if people are buying it.  Your task is to get
>> people to buy it.  "Just being listed at Amazon.com" doesn't make
>> people buy the book.
>>   --scott
>>
> --
> Adam Hyde
> Founder FLOSS Manuals
> German mobile : + 49 15 2230 54563
> Email : adam at flossmanuals.net
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>
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