[FM Discuss] Editions [was : ISBN Numbers Summary]

Tue Mar 31 14:17:18 PDT 2009

On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 8:12 PM, Anne Gentle
<annegentle at justwriteclick.com> wrote:
> Thing is, with manuals, there are no editions. Sometimes software gets
> updated too often for the writers to keep up, even paid ones in an
> enterprise situation. In that case, Release notes and Patch doc of
> some sort are sufficient. For Open Source products, those types of
> docs might live only on the open source project's wiki or release
> pages, but not on FLOSS Manuals. I see Sugar's updates the same way -
> there's a manual for 0.84, but it's not an edition. When we update for
> 0.86, we probably won't even need a new ISBN or need to call it an
> edition. There will be some of the six-month releases are not going to
> be worthy of more than release notes, is my guess. This 0.84 release
> is quite substantial and a break-off point though, so it's important
> to do a full book update. 0.86 may be the same way but we'll make that
> call when we come to it.

Sorry, I was using the term edition too broadly.  I tried to use it as
similar to major version in software development.  Anne and others in
this tread have explained it better.

A book can continue to us the same ISBN until there is a _good_ reason
to communicate to readers and resellers that the content has change.
These decisions can be handled as they arise.

david

> Editions aren't the right term for "manuals" in the enterprise
> environment either.
>
> I also wonder what do Emma Jane or Janet say about open source
> manuals? Does Drupal or Open Office get a new "manual" each release,
> or just release notes?
>
> Now, to offer another viewpoint on books, I've run into a separate
> "book" request at work before, and in a consulting request - the
> company wants a 3rd party book from a publisher for a product. That is
> a different type of book than a manual. The interesting thing about
> FLOSS Manuals is that we are at the cusp of being able to offer a
> fully branded book set that could take off as much as the Head Start
> series did (those books are amazing and writers have to audition to be
> considered to write for them). We offer our own voice and style and
> it's pretty darn good. Thing is, where I work, we don't have the print
> run numbers for someone to find writing a 3rd party book worth their
> time/effort. But with a toolset like FLOSS Manuals, an independent
> group of authors writing about open source may find it worth their
> time and effort - savings in teaching materials, reuse/remix savings,
> and so on.
>
> For example, writing a "3rd party book" (there's probably a better
> term but I'm not sure what it is) about Sugar (like a teachers
> workbook) would be a very different thing than a manual for Sugar. But
> you may save time/effort by remixing in chapters from the Sugar Users
> Guide.
>
> So I guess I would say FLOSS Manuals is at this interesting junction
> where we provide classic manuals but also provide something like "3rd
> party" books. It's a neat junction to be at, but there are different
> expectations for a manual than a "3rd party" book. That's my take of
> the situation. I'd love to hear from others' experiences as well.
>
> Anne
>
> On Sun, Mar 29, 2009 at 2:18 PM, David Farning <dfarning at sugarlabs.org> wrote:
>> On Sat, Mar 28, 2009 at 2:05 PM, adam hyde <adam at flossmanuals.net> wrote:
>>> hi,
>>>
>>> This has been a very interesting and educational discussion. I have one
>>> basic question - why do we need to update the isbn per 'edition'?
>>> Indeed, why even talk of editions?
>>>
>>> I find the idea of editions belongs to a mode of operating that doesn't
>>> suit at all how we actually work. It would be very odd for us to get to
>>> a point of questioning if this is edition 1.2.3 or 7. For example. I
>>> have published 12 revisions of the command line book since it was
>>> released. What place does an edition have in this work flow?
>>>
>>> I don't see it. I am very loathe for us to get stuck on this because it
>>> seems to be a term that belongs to how publishing works and not how we
>>> work. We are in a transitional moment, its true, and we are offering a
>>> way of creating sophisticated content which doesn't currently sit easily
>>> within existing publishing practice and occassionally we will have to
>>> bend a little to fit into the existing practices...but I don't see this
>>> as necessary within the context of this current discussion until vendors
>>> start pushing FM books and stamping their feet because we dont make
>>> sense to them. Then we might have to harmonise a little with their
>>> inventory management processes and call something 'edition x'.
>>
>> Yes, I agree that FM certainly makes the concepts of reprints and
>> editions rather vague.
>>
>> For Sugar Labs the notion of 'Edition' rears its ugly head when
>> talking about Sugar.82, Sugar.84, and Sugar.86.  At any given time, we
>> will have at least three different possible versions of Sugar in
>> production environment.  The software appears and behaves differently
>> enough that a user referencing the .86 book while working with the .82
>> software will become confused.
>>
>> I am using edition, possibly incorrectly, to denote the 'book' that
>> documents a particular software version.
>>
>> david
>>
>>> Until then I would very much enjoy being liberated from ideas of
>>> Editions when discussing FM. It doesnt seem to me to reflect how we
>>> actually work, and it suggests a workflow and paradigm that we don't,
>>> from choice, fit.
>>>
>>> adam
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, 2009-03-28 at 10:32 -0400, C. Scott Ananian wrote:
>>>> On Fri, Mar 27, 2009 at 8:50 PM, David Farning <dfarning at sugarlabs.org> wrote:
>>>> > A second level of confusions results because in addition of buying a
>>>> > block of ISBNs a publisher must register a book's the title in 'Books
>>>> > in Print' Database.  It is via accessing the Books in print database
>>>> > that other wholesaler and resellers can order and sell the book.
>>>> >
>>>> > In addition to the 'Books in Print' publishers can register with other
>>>> > services to raise their profile.  To extend the phone metaphor past
>>>> > its useful life.... Every phone number is listed in the white pages.
>>>> > The more you pay the bigger your add in the yellow pages.
>>>>
>>>> I'd be wary of paying for there "other services".  Really, Books in
>>>> Print is more like the white pages, not the yellow pages.  It's free
>>>> (more or less) and just provides a <isbn number> to <contact
>>>> information for distributor> mapping, so that if you want 500 copies
>>>> of a particular ISBN, you look up the right phone number and call up
>>>> the distributor to order them.  That's it, it's easy.
>>>>
>>>> The trick is that many large retailers don't like dealing with small
>>>> distributors.  So even though the "number's in the book" for the ISBN,
>>>> they won't pick up the phone and call, because their ordering systems
>>>> aren't integrated, or they've have bad experiences with billing, or
>>>> they've been scammed in the past, or it's just more trouble than it's
>>>> worth.
>>>>
>>>> People offer lots of suggestions for how to "make it worth their
>>>> while" (these "other services") but in my experience and opinion,
>>>> they're mostly scams -- and often counter productive scams, which will
>>>> cause businesses to avoid lulu-printed books even more when the hook
>>>> is discovered.  It's not that hard to get your book listed, and Amazon
>>>> *will* stock your book if people are buying it.  Your task is to get
>>>> people to buy it.  "Just being listed at Amazon.com" doesn't make
>>>> people buy the book.
>>>>   --scott
>>>>
>>> --
>>> Adam Hyde
>>> Founder FLOSS Manuals
>>> German mobile : + 49 15 2230 54563
>>> Email : adam at flossmanuals.net
>>> irc: irc.freenode.net #flossmanuals
>>>
>>> "Free manuals for free software"
>>> http://www.flossmanuals.net/about
>>>
>>>
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>
>
>
> --
> Anne Gentle
> email: annegentle at justwriteclick.com
> blog: www.justwriteclick.com
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